Talking BAHACon 2025 with Jeff Brooks

[0:01] This is Glass City Humanist, a show about humanism, humanist values, by a humanist. Here is your host, Douglas Berger. In this episode, amidst the dumpster fire that is the new presidential administration, we have some good news for the trans community in Ohio. Then we talk to Jeff Brooks from Bluewater Atheists, Humanists, and Agnostics about their August conference in Sarnia, Ontario. Glass City Humanist is an outreach project of the Secular Humanists of Western Lake Erie, building community through compassion and reason for a better tomorrow.

[1:01] The past couple of months since the new presidential administration took over in January, it’s been a dumpster fire for people who support social justice issues, who support marginalized communities or intentionally marginalized communities like the LGBTQ community. And it’s been rough. People are generally upset that the current administration is doing what they can to hurt as many people who can’t afford to be hurt, who don’t want to be hurt. And so it’s been rough. It’s been rough that a person that is in office, the highest office in the land, is shredding our American values, our humanist values, and is hurting a lot of people.

[2:00] And so, you know, it can get pretty bleak, depressing, doom scrolling on your phone, whatever. But I have some good news for you for a change. Believe it or not, we have some good news. And what it is, is on March the 18th, in a sweeping decision, The Ohio’s 10th District Court of Appeals ruled that the state’s ban on gender-affirming health care for transgender youth is unconstitutional. And this was Ohio House Bill 68 that was passed in January of 2024 over the veto of Governor Mike DeWine. The bill also bans transgender girls and women and trans feminine people from competing in girls and women’s sports. But the court ruling that I’m going to talk about didn’t address that. That wasn’t part of the court case. The court case was filed by the American Civil Liberties Union of Ohio, claiming that it violated the rights of transgender Ohioans under four separate sections of the state’s constitution.

[3:13] Originally, when they filed the lawsuit, an Ohio Common Police Court judge ruled in favor of the ban. And so then the ACLU then appealed it to the 10th District Court of Appeals. And it said that the appellate court sent the case back to the trial court and imposed a permanent injunction on HB 68’s ban on the use of puberty blockers hormones for the purpose of assisting the minor individual with gender transition. It says, writing for the majority, Judge Carly Edelstein issued a pointed and often scathing opinion of both the state’s position on and legislature’s passing of HB 68, specifically as it applies to banning puberty blockers and gender-affirming hormone therapy. Lawmakers asserted that health care practitioners could be accused of wrongdoing for providing gender transition services. The appellate court rejected this definition and the legislature’s power to identify and prohibit medical procedures that it considers wrongdoing or bad medical practice, even if some citizens or doctors disagree.

[4:25] It says, we find the state’s position is belied by the fundamental principles embedded in our state constitution and the plain meaning of wrongdoing. Now, where they got a lot of help in doing this court case actually came from some of the same people that passed this law to ban gender affirming care. The decision repeatedly referenced the Health Care Freedom Amendment, a constitutional amendment that was approved by Ohio voters in 2011. And that was in response to the beginning of the Affordable Care Act, or as the right-wingers called Obamacare.

[5:12] This amendment that was passed in 2011 established that no federal, state, or local law shall prohibit the purchase or sale of health care or health insurance. In several sections, the decision concluded that gender transition services constitute health care and that HB 68 violated the will of voters by banning medically approved practices. Now, what I like about this decision is the court said that gender transition services was health care. That’s something that the Ohio legislature claimed it wasn’t health care. The people that they had, that the state brought in to testify in this court case, weren’t even experts in gender transitioning. One of the guys who advocated against gender affirming care had never treated somebody with gender dysphoria. And yet he’s making claims about the treatment.

[6:14] Meanwhile, all of the professional and hospital groups and medical people that actually treat these kids and treat gender dysphoria were against this law. And for reasons because it was medical. It was a medical health care. All right. So the appellate decision concluded that HB 68 denied Ohio’s parents’ right to due process by attempting to declare that type of health care as wrongdoing because it is modern. And so the opinion lambasted the state’s position that denigrated gender affirming care as being modern and said that such a conclusion would lead to parents only having a fundamental right to treatments existing as of 1851, 1868, or 1912. Basically, what it was is the state contended that gender affirming treatment was experimental.

[7:16] And so they could regulate it. And this court was saying, well, no, you can’t. Additionally, the decision harshly criticized the state’s choice to ban access to puberty-blocking medications like gonatropidin-releasing hormone agonist for transgender minors while allowing cisgender minors access to the same prescriptions, so long as the prescription is not for the purpose of assisting the minor individual with gender transition. The court said the state’s double standard undermines its contention that the challenge provisions are aimed at protecting children from experimental treatment and the longer-term irreversible effects that may be associated with some aspects of that treatment. It says the court also found that HB 68 directly violates Ohio parents’ right to due process.

[8:07] Allowing the state to make the same decision for all parents without consideration of any minor child’s individual circumstances or the recommendations of any treating medical provider. And this was one of the arguments that when this bill came up, this is some of the arguments that I used when I talked about it in previous podcast episodes and in social media, was that the same people that claimed that parents had a right to their child to go to religious education classes, because they deemed that parental rights.

[8:46] Were taking those parental rights away from parents who wanted to provide gender-affirming care to their children.

[8:55] And how that didn’t make sense in the court agreed not only that, but then that’s how it violated that Health Care Freedom Act that they so generously got approved 10 years ago, more than 10 years ago. I don’t think that they saw that coming. So, of course, Attorney General David Yost, he is planning on appealing, obviously. And he says, this is a no-brainer. We are appealing that decision and will seek immediate stay. There is no way I’ll stop fighting to protect these unprotected children. And he’s wrong because they are protected. There are medical guidelines and medical ethics that guide these treatments, and the parents always have to approve it anyway. So there is informed consent. It’s not a van driving around the neighborhood looking for kids to transition, as they claim. That’s the inference that they make when they argue about this stuff. So, I just wanted to make sure I gave you guys some good news for once. Hopefully, it brightens your day a little bit.

[10:09] For more information about the topics in this episode, including links used, please visit the episode page at glasscityhumanist.show.

[10:22] All right. Our guest today is Jeff Brooks. He is the vice president of the… I knew I was going to mess it up. That’s okay. The Bluewater, Atheist, Humanist, and Agnostic. So, or BAHA. BAHA, right. BAHA. And they are putting on their BAHA Con in August. Ticket sales start on April the 1st. It’s going to be in Sarnia, which is up in Ontario, across from Port Huron. So, it’s about, for those in the Toledo area, it’s about a two-hour drive or so. And, uh, it looks like it’s going to be a good time. Thank you for joining us today, Jeff. Yeah. Thanks for having me. Um, could you tell us a little bit about yourself and about the group and, and, uh, why you’re, you came up with this conference? Sure. So, um, I don’t have a terribly exciting, uh, journey, at least I don’t think like a lot of people have. Um i grew up in a town of about 30 000 people in ontario so born and raised in in ontario and um went to church with mom as most people do although my dad was always atheist and um.

[11:42] Uh probably i can’t honestly say there was a time when i um really thought about it or really believed in it I suppose it was a social event because I had friends that went to the same church, the church I went to was called the United Church of Canada which is like church light, the opposite end of the spectrum of the Pentecostal and Baptist churches, and then when I got into high school got into sciences, got into higher education it just all seemed to be.

[12:18] None of it made any sense anymore. Not that it really did a lot before, but that kind of put the icing on the cake. So I would say I’ve been, I call myself agnostic for a number of years just because I was maybe hedging bets. But now I call myself an atheist or I also really refer to myself as a humanist. You know, as so many people have said, atheism just explains what I don’t believe in, but humanism explains what I do believe in. So the conference is coming up in August. Uh, what year is this the conference of? I know you’ve, you’ve done it for a number of years. Yeah. So this would be the fourth year of our conference. Um, the first year I was there simply in the audience as a participant. Um, I was on a few websites. I’ve followed Seth Andrews for, for many years. And I know all your listeners will be familiar with who Seth Andrews is or, and, uh, I was on his website. It had a list of places I’m going to be, and I’m looking through it, and it’s like Sarnia, Ontario. I’m like, that’s 30 minutes from where I live. What’s that like? So we went down, my girlfriend and I went down on one day just to participate. And then Bob Barnes, who’s sort of the real backbone of Baha, he sort of started it and really is the powerhouse organizing Baha.

[13:46] He approached me. I sort of kind of got some of the breakfasts and some of the dinners that the group would hold. And then he approached me to see if i would be interested in uh being on the board so i was on the board um for the second year and ended up uh being the mc actually so i was mc had been mc for the last couple years and um.

[14:09] I can say every year it’s gotten better uh bigger and better it’s still um far as conferences go i think it’s a nice size we expect probably 200 to 250 people we’ll see how how it goes but it’s nice in that um we design it so that there’s lots of opportunity for networking and uh meeting other people talking with the speakers and uh it’s really a fun weekend of making new friends Yeah. And, uh, uh, Seth Andrews, he’s been on the guest list a number of years, has he not? Uh, Seth has been on every, every year, um, that we’ve had it. Um, and he’s, uh, you know, graciously coming back again this year. One nice thing with Seth Andrews, every year is different. Every speech is different and it’s always dynamic and just holds everybody, uh, to the edge of their Yeah, and I also noticed, too, that you have Dr. Anthony Penn and Dr. Phil Zuckerman, too, this year. We do. Not the type of doctors if you’re sick, but we’ve got lots of doctors.

[15:20] We also have Dr. Christopher DiCarlo is going to be there, and John Loftus, I’m sure a lot of your people are familiar with. And uh coming back he was we had him last year he’s coming back again this year as uh forest and as an added bonus we have uh guts at gibbon erica um is coming as well um we’re just i’m not sure with both erica and forest in the same room if we have to keep them apart or if we if they get too close together if they’re if their brain power creates like a black hole i’m not sure i think kind of like crossing the streams and ghostbusters you have to keep them a certain distance apart, but yeah, really looking forward to it.

[16:04] So at this conference, what can you expect? If they were to buy a ticket and show up, what would they expect to do? Sure. So I’ll start off just with sort of the theme of what it is that we’re trying to accomplish. One thing we are not trying to accomplish is a conference that has religion bashing. That isn’t, I don’t think, helpful.

[16:34] It isn’t the kind of thing that we want to have. We really want to have it more educational and learning. So that’s where we get like the dr abby hafer who’s coming this year to talk about the unintelligent design we have uh you know forest valkai and and guts at gibbon um the conference starts off uh friday night if for that a total package ticket uh we have a sit-down um meal a vip dinner uh the speakers are sitting out with everyone they uh they’re uh very approachable and you know you may have stuff at your table or forest at your table for dinner um and then uh saturday morning we have a nice breakfast and then get right into uh the some of the speakers so uh we have speakers uh saturday we have a lunch a buffet lunch that’s included.

[17:27] Uh saturday uh for dinner people are on their own there’s a lovely a lot of lovely restaurants in the area and then we have a vip or a social night kind of a wrap-up at the end of saturday, after party where this year we’re going to have a panel of podcasters doing a podcast panel and then we’re going to have a game night so we’re going to have tables set up with different board games and we’re going to try to get some of the old favorites like snakes and ladders and sorry and those kind of things and uh just an opportunity uh to sit around and have a drink and uh you know have that uh that camaraderie and and meet new friends and then sunday we have breakfast again sunday morning.

[18:17] And then uh we have a couple speakers we’ll have a couple speakers on sunday and then we uh go to um, on a boat cruise so we have a uh a boat that goes up and down the st clair river for those not familiar with the area the st clair river runs between canada and the united states so It is the border, so we run up the river, and we have some sandwiches and refreshments on the boat. The speakers are all on the boat with us, so you can catch them and have a chat with them on the boat. They’re captive for three hours as we cruise the river.

[18:58] And then, yeah, that takes us to the end of the conference. Yeah, I heard in the past that the boat option has been very popular. Like it sells out pretty quick it does so, starting April 1st when our tickets go on sale we have early bird tickets to start with until June I believe but for those that want the whole package I certainly encourage people to get their tickets early, we can handle say you know if we had 250 I’d be happy we can do 300 at the conference easily but the boat is much more limited so once we sell out about 150, 40 boat tickets, then that’s all we can really need for the boat. It’s, uh, uh, when they’re having people having to hang on the sides or water. Well, I heard it was cause there was only one boat or, uh, Or something like that. Bob told me that one year. There was only one boat. Yeah, it’s just one boat. It’s an A-sized boat. It’s called the Duke d’Orlean.

[20:01] And it has, as every boat does, has a limited capacity as to how many people you can have on board. It would not bode well for our conference if we sank and our speakers had to be rescued. We would struggle to get speakers the following year. So we want to make sure we keep it under the limit that’s required on the boat. But it is, it is a fun time and it’s a beautiful, uh, a beautiful cruise. We’ve been really fortunate. Um, every year the weather has been, has been beautiful for it. So we haven’t had any issues that way, but it is covered. So if even if we had a little bit of rain last year and it’s not a problem, it’s, it is covered. So you’re not, you’re not getting soaked.

[20:42] And the location is going to be the four points by Sherrod and Marriott. And it’s just over the bridge um and they yeah so if you’re yeah go ahead sorry so if you’re coming up the Bluewater bridge to come into canada um you can actually see the bridge from the see the hotel from the bridge like we are literally uh three minutes inside of canada so we’re very very very very close uh the hotel over the last couple years has undergone a A major renovation, the area that we’re in for the conference, the guest rooms are all, have been renovated. If you’re going to be staying at the hotel, we have a special rate for the conference. So call the conference or the hotel and they will get you the special rate. So the event, this event is taking place in Canada. Is there any special requirements or anything that a U.S. person needs to know before they attend?

[21:40] Um no just if you’re coming into canada um you’ll need a passport or um some states have an enhanced driver’s license that can allow you to do that um or any sort of type of photo identification that’s accepted by um uh by custom so nexus those kind of things also are uh are good and uh yeah Yeah, it’s pretty simple and straightforward to come in. And the other thing too that I like about this conference is the exchange rate is pretty good, which means it doesn’t cost the U.S. Person as much as it does the Canadian person.

[22:21] No, the exchange rate right now is, is very good. So, um, better all the time as I, as I look at the numbers sometimes, but, um, hopefully it stays very economical for people from the United States. Yeah. Hopefully it stays that way. If you get your tickets early, it’ll lock that in, I guess. Right. Correct. Yeah. How hard was it getting speakers to attend, to participate?

[22:48] Um, it’s actually been, uh, pretty good. So I mentioned Bob Byrnes as our president. Bob has been active in the humanist and atheist community for many years. So he has a lot of people that he knows. And I think over the last couple of years, as our conference has become more known, we’ve had really pretty easy time getting quality speakers. Um you know i i the challenge for us is changing speakers every year um the people we’ve had in the past um david pittsgerald dr josh bowen r and raw you know they become almost like family and you get to know them and really become friends with them so um there is a temptation to have the same people back every year but we know we can’t do that so we have to change it up a bit so um but we’ve had very good luck, um, getting the speakers that we’ve, uh, that we’ve looked for. And, uh, like most conferences have, uh, exhibitors and, uh, like vendors, are you, is your conference going to have that as well?

[24:00] The vendors we have, we have a few vendors or a few information booths, things like Freedom from Religion will often set up a booth for us. And the speakers will have tables where they will sell their books. So you can get a signed copy of a book from Seth Andrew or Abby Hafer or those types of people. And that’s always very popular. And then are you still intending to distribute the profits to charity? And if so, which ones have you chosen? yeah so we every year we’ve uh donated our profits uh to charities so this year we’re going to be donating to the alzheimer’s society and Bluewater health which is the health center in uh lambton county that does a lot of really good stuff with um hospice and palliative care And they also do the whole gamut of health care from delivering babies to helping people die well. So it’s a really good organization.

[25:15] And do you, as part of the conference, do you recommend other activities for people to do while they’re there besides what’s official? There are a few things to do in the area. We don’t have a lot of time during the conference, but if you come earlier or later, we have a number of sites you can see in Lambton County.

[25:38] Lambton County is actually the first place in the world where an oil well was ever drilled. So we have a couple of museums dedicated to the history of oil and the drilling for oil. We actually have a town that’s named Petrolia. We have a town called Oil Springs. So really the home of the oil industry started in Lampton County. We also have a number of other museums, some heritage museums, and lots of really nice parks. And the waterfront is beautiful. I did want to ask you, though, you guys also have, you’re known for your beaches, right? It’s kind of like a summer hangout area during the summer, I mean? Yeah, very much. Yeah, we got some very beautiful beaches in, uh, in Lampton County, an area called Ipperwash, an area called Grand Bend, um, really nice beaches, beautiful sunsets. And, uh, and Sardi itself has some beautiful beaches and parks, um, to explore. Somebody wants to get a ticket. Uh, how do they do that and how much is it going to cost?

[26:51] Sure. So our early bird for the total package is $350 Canadian. And they’ll be available through Eventbrite. And that will be. We also have tickets for those that can’t make for the entire conference. We will have. Yes, there’ll be a link through our website. To get to Eventbrite to purchase. And that ticket includes all your meals. It includes the dinner Friday night. It includes the boat crews. The total package includes the whole thing for $350 Canadian.

[27:32] So as we kind of wrap up on this interview today and you’re talking to the people that are listening in, what would you want them to take away from not only this conference, but about your group? One of the most important things is that we’re really about community. And when you come to our conference, one thing you’ll notice right away is that we all have, we have round tables that everyone sits at. We don’t sit in stadium style rows. And we do that because we want people to talk. We want people to make friends. We want to have conversation.

[28:12] Um, and that’s really important to us in the conference. Um, we keep the conference small so that people have those opportunities and, uh, that sense of community really is important for us. Um, and you know, Canada is a very friendly place. We are very friendly people and we would love to love to see you there. Well, Jeff, I really appreciate you joining us today and telling us about the BAHA Con 2025. And again, it’s going on from August 8th to the 10th in Sarnia, Ontario, which is located directly across from Port Huron, Michigan, on the St. Clair River. Beautiful St. Clair River. And I encourage anybody that can attend to attend. Go to their website and I’ll have the information on the show notes and get a ticket starting on April the 1st. Pleasure. And I look forward to seeing a lot of your listeners there.

[29:10] Thank you for listening. For more information about the topics in this episode, please visit the episode page at glasscityhumanist.show.

[29:24] Glass City Humanist is an outreach of the secular humanists of Western Lake Erie. Sholee can be reached at humanistswle.org. Glass City Humanist is hosted, written, and produced by Douglas Berger, and he’s solely responsible for the content. Our theme music is Glass City Jam, composed using the Amplify Studio. See you next time!

[29:54] Music.